The Inconvenient Truth: Kamen Rider Build is the worst toku in history

Discussion in 'Henshin Justice Unlimited' started by Captain Shark, Aug 26, 2018.

  1. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    This is hard to admit, especially after decades of tokusatsu watching. Movies, television, specials, the works. Kamen Rider has always had a distinction from Ultraman, Super Sentai, Godzilla, and Gamera in which there was a range of quality. You could never predict what the score would end up being because every series had things going for and against it, usually limited to one or two entries. I've been vocal about the entries I've disliked as I have the ones I enjoyed.

    And now we have Build. I didn't start watching this until June because Ex-Aid left a very bad taste in my mouth. It wasn't quite as bad as some other entries I could name, but Build? Build is a game changer and I dare say to a transcendent extent. It took me a while to accept it, but not only is Kamen Rider Build the worst entry in the franchise, it's also the worst tokusatsu I have ever witnessed in its entirety. Worse than Kabuto or The Next or that awful Kamen Rider Specter epilogue movie. Worse than Half Human. Worse than Dogora. Worse than Daimajin Kanon. Worse than Bio Planet WoO. Worse than Reigo or Raiga. Worse than Shougeki Gouraigan. Worse than Megaranger or Gokaiger. Worse than Godzilla Resurgance or the Kiryu movies. Worse than Gamera vs. Viras or Jiger. Worse than Gappa. Worse than Kujira Gami.

    I'm stunned at this and it took me a while to piece together why it was so atrocious, but after a lot of thought it became apparent that Build had the vast majority of problems other heisei rider entries had.

    -An ultra super serious tone clashing with cartoony humor (W and Gaim)
    -Lacking monsters of the week (Gaim)
    -Tertiary riders that do very little after they become good (Ghost)
    -Constant distractions from the plot (Ryuki, Faiz, Blade, and Kabuto)
    -Doppleganger of the main hero becomes a red herring (Kabuto)
    -Constant drastic costume changes to the point where base form is never used (Ex-Aid)
    -Unnecessary duo riders that do nothing (Kabuto)
    -Trying to shove in unnecessary politics (Faiz and Gaim)
    -Questionable camera work trying to hard to be artsy (Kuuga and Agito)
    -Random tonal shifts (Hibiki and Den-O)
    -Drastic focus on the main villain where everything else takes a back seat (Ex-Aid)
    -Little build up to anything (Faiz, Hibiki, and Den-O)
    -Base form somehow has a chance against the main villain when it should never (W and Ex-Aid)
    -Useless female side character only there for humor (many entries, but W did this the worst)
    -Lackluster final battle (Hibiki and Decade)
    -Forced drama that served nothing (Ryuki and Blade)
    -Putting in multiverse theory without much exploration into the idea (Decade)
    -Atrocious music (Kabuto and Ghost)
    -Slow pacing (half the heisei series)

    What makes this worse than the movies is that movies rarely exceed two hours. By the end I had nothing positive to say about this, it somehow accomplished doing literally everything wrong much like Fate/Stay Night and Fate/Zero. I'm almost impressed. From the moment I pressed play for the first episode all the way to the final moments of the last episode there was only noise. Awful, atrocious, abominable, a genuine disaster for an entire genre.

    Here's to Kamen Rider Zi-O, please redeem the franchise like how Gundam Build Divers saved Gundam from Iron Blooded Orphans.
     
  2. mbozzo

    mbozzo New Member

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    It's a pity that you didn't like the Kamen Rider series. If you're right, it might explain why Kamen Rider never caught on in America. :(
     
  3. Black Fang

    Black Fang Member

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    It seems to be a running theme for you to hate things that are generally liked by the fandom.

    W, Gaim and Build are the high points in what has otherwise been a lackluster decade of Phase 2 Heisei, which can be summed up by "good ideas that are poorly executed". I don't know why you'd consider Build the worst of the lot when Ghost and Wizard exist.
     
  4. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    Strange how you mentioned three of the four low points (the last one being Ex-Aid) as "high" points because they were the lackluster ones in an otherwise solid decade. As for Wizard and Ghost, the former is one of the best entries in the franchise and the latter was kind of solid all around. As I said before Build is pretty much just the cons of entries from this century. Nobody else is willing to call it out so I will.
     
  5. raden238

    raden238 New Member

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    For me Hibiki and Ghost are the worst in Rider history. Hibiki had a god awful tonal shift, half way into the series, that completely change everything for the worse. The villains and characters were never interesting. Ghost was very bad, as they literally only had 10 monster suits being reused over and over again. One of the worst protagonists in Takkeru, who's fate went against everything the lore was about. (How can you be a Ghost Rider, if you're not dead and why would he chose to come back to life instead of helping others?). The story for Ghost sucks too.

    Build I felt was essentially a repeat of Ex-Aid. They had the buddy Rider format since the beginning, a villain Rider that turned goofy by the end of the series, and wayyyy too much Build-up for a Final Boss Kamen Rider. If you don't like Ex-Aid, you wouldn't like Build. I thought the show was average, I hope Kamen Rider can change the format again. Zi-O seems to be going for yet another buddy-Rider format with Geiz. I wish they can go back to a solo Rider show (Kuuga) or the two parter arc format (Wizard). We haven't gotten either in a while.
     
  6. Black Fang

    Black Fang Member

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    I might agree with one or two of Shark's points (though most of them range from petty to trivial to nonsensical). But call me paranoid, this thread feels a trolling attempt to spark conversation in an otherwise dead/dying fanboard.

    Are toku fans just not familiar with what Kamen Rider is supposed to be about? All of Ishinomori's heroes and stories revolve around politics to some degree. Kamen Rider, in varying degrees, has always dealt with shadow governments/New World Order, the paranormal and other "things that go unseen", with a dash of Coast To Coast AM radio fodder. Complaining about politics in Rider just screams ignorance, to be quite frank. You can argue whether or not it's been done well (sometimes it is, sometimes not), but don't tell us it doesn't belong at all.
     
  7. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    Build's last 8 episodes may have fumbled the ball in story telling, but I can not disagree with your post more. Build was 40 episodes of no filler whatsoever. It was all story, something that hadn't been done since Blade. Hell, technically episodes 41-49 were not filler either, but rather the final battle dragged out to be 9 episodes long with breaks between each round.

    The tones were just fine as it balanced comedy and drama together. One never felt like it over powered the other.

    The camera work was stellar, just like Blade. As was the music, also like Blade, W, and Gaim.

    I will agree with the female characters, which is a shame as Misora started out really strong with the Vernage plot that went nowhere and they never did anything with the traitor girl.

    Now is Build as good as W and Gaim? No, however, it's on equal footing with both OOO and Fourze.

    If I were to rank the Heisei series overall, it would go as follows (only going to count the ones I watched in full):

    1. Blade
    2. W
    3. Gaim
    4. Agito
    5. Ryuki
    6. OOO
    7. Fourze
    8. Kuuga
    9. Kiva
    10. Build
    11. Hibiki
    12. Wizard
    13. Den-O
    14. Kabuto
    15. 555
    16. Decade

    If you really think Build is the worst Toku in history, then you need to watch Ultra Seven X, Kamen Rider Black Rx, Lion Maru G, Shogeki Gouraigan, Garo The One Who Shines in Darkness, Goseiger, Kyuuranger, Ninninger, and Turboranger.
     
  8. NeonZ

    NeonZ Member

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    Considering your post, it's clear you dislike running story and prefer episodic shows, but some of the complaints make no sense even considering that, like claiming that Build had a slow pacing or constant distractions from the plot. Build never had Gaim's weird tie in episodes that brought the story to a halt. It was always going ahead. Even the scene inserted to explain Build's early cameo for example was incorporated straight into the main plot (Sabotaged belt to explain why Build didn't have Gorilla in the beginning of the show).

    The story was always moving ahead full throttle. The only oddity was the Lost Bottles arc, but that was more due to it feeling like a de-escalation coming from Evol fighting directly to mostly hanging around in what was basically Neo Faust, before actually continuing the battle against him.

    The tertiary Riders also got their own battles and moments even after joining, both episodes where they shone by themselves and episodes where they were part of successful group efforts. You really can't compare it to Ghost where they weren't even allowed to beat monsters of the week and got immediately removed from play once attempting to fight the real villains. Compare Gentoku damaging the Evol Trigger to Specter and Necrom getting instantly beaten by the Great Eyezer and just standing in the sidelines while Takeru fought against it (and then next episode they just appeared to get crushed by Genm without accomplishing anything either).

    As for the base form, you seem to have forgotten Hazard levels, Evolt's form is also shown to be falling apart and regressing through the battle and Banjo also was getting in his way - and don't forget the damaged Evol Trigger. Same thing happens in Ex-Aid - they only beat Cronus once his driver is damaged. It's really only W out of those examples that had Utopia randomly being very weak overall once his "trick" was discovered even though previously he was beating Accel even before touching him.

    Also, complaining about the camera work is just odd. Yes, it tried to be artsy... but how is that a problem? The action and such were still there. At least that gives Build some unique memorable visuals.
     
  9. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    There is no trolling, that came directly from my own thoughts. If there is a worse toku out there I have not seen it.
    I don't read manga so you're likely right and they just don't translate into toku.
    I disagree with this but okay.
    Of all the entries to pick why Blade? There was very little going for that, it seems like something out of left field.
    With the exceptions of Lion Maru and Kyuranger I have seen these and only Shougeki Gouraigan was bad (I even mentioned that in the opening post).
    Not true, Nexus is my third favorite Ultra series and Drive is my favorite Kamen Rider and I hardly call them episodic.
    Until the tournament arc it didn't really have a "plot" as much as it was a series of random events lossely tied to a "I was framed for murder" subplot which was somehow forgotten about.
    And strangely those were Gaim's best, they weren't trying to be the uber dark and serial-ness with pretenciousness sprinkled on it.
    A lot of which could have fit in a web series.
    I'll take the sidelining, they're not in the title and main riders are supposed to be the best. Adding too many feels like baggage after a while.
    And Cronus was the only good thing in the last three quarters of Ex-Aid and had proven, in fact you just proved Raden's point it just liked to copy off of Ex-Aid.
    It's bad and displays nobody on staff can edit or angle correctly.
    The kind of memorable that turns the worst of fiction into legends.


    Might as well rank every entry from my perspective:

    Drive > Skyrider > OOO > Black RX > Original > Wizard > Decade > Stronger > Fourze > Black > Amazon > Kiva > Super-1 > Agito > J > ZO > Ghost > ZX > V3 > Kuuga > 555 > Hibiki > X > Gaim > Den-O > W > Ex-Aid > Shin > Ryuki > Blade > G > SD > The First > Kabuto > The Next > Build
     
  10. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    Because Blade is by far the greatest Kamen Rider series of all time. It has the best riders, amazing cinematography, excellent characters, some of the best designs in the franchise, a phenomenal soundtrack with two incredible opening songs, intriguing plots, and one of the most well thought out endings.

    Uh what? First off, Drive is the very definition of episodic. It's the same two parter over every time, just with a different monster. Something goes awry, Drive investigates, Drive finds the problem, Drive fights the monster, Chaser shows up, fights Drive, the monster gets away, Chaser leaves because his job is done, Drive has to refind the monster, Chaser shows up and gets beaten, Drive uncovers the monster's true identity and defeats it.

    There's a reason I dropped Drive after like episode 23.

    Nexus is also not even remotely story driven. It's all episodic because until Orb, that is what Ultraman was.

    Now you're clearly trolling as those abominations were easily Gaim's worst episodes.

    Your taste in rider shows suck ass. :D Rx is by far one of the worst Kamen Rider shows out there.
     
  11. Japaneseseriesfan

    Japaneseseriesfan A simple passerby...

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    I agree with Dr Kain, your taste in Rider is just shit. Drive was one of the more subpar entries in Rider I've ever seen. And THAT was episodic.

    Trying to be artsy? It was Guerilla Filmmaking. It worked well to Kuuga's favor. I'm not even defending it because I saw Kuuga as a 5 year old, and grew up with Toku, I'm defending it because it was wise use of technique to display movement in a way that brought intensity.

    I don't know why, but I feel like you're one of those people who just have a poor knack of understanding of filmmaking and creativity in general to even say Wizard was a good show. That was a pile of shit that aired during my senior year in High School and felt like a cash grab to try and be like Kuuga given how it started the trend of many forms = many figure sales, without even utilizing those forms properly in the show itself.

    There is a way of mixing comedy with seriousness. You said you don't read manga, fair enough. You might not even watch anime, that's fine (assumption here). But then that means you've only been invested in Toku and almost nothing else that came from Japanese media, and probably grew up on mostly American Television. Which is probably where the problem lies. I've seen things I can relate with on both ends, but I understand why people on the western end won't get if you only have that perspective. I grew up in an internationally diverse community. I can make that shift between Eastern and Western thinking. It just feels to me like you're limited to what you liked and were influenced by to appreciate the bigger picture of it all.
     
  12. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    You missed out bigly.
    That simply isn't correct, Nexus was very plot driven.
    I don't troll, it's the truth.
    No need to hurl insults there, doc.
    Just because it has a name and style doesn't mean it will always work.
    That is not correct.
    I have an open mind, I am also able to point to something and just call the spade a spade.
     
  13. Toku Prime

    Toku Prime Member

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    Eh, some of the points I agree with. A lot of them I don't ('Be The One' is a banger & has been appearing regularly in my Spotify playlists). But I can't knock the Cap'n for having an opinion. Heck, I've been in that place where it seems as if everyone loves a show that I really didn't enjoy. *cough* Agito *cough*

    What I will say is, the more toku I see that aren't made by Toei the more I appreciate how they always get the technical aspects of a show down to a tee and how slickly presented everything they do is. So even if I don't like a particular season, I couldn't call any Rider (or Sentai) the worst ever.

    Anyway, isn't it a strength of the franchise that different entries cater to different tastes? If they were all very similar it probably would have died off long ago (see how Showa Rider never managed more than five consecutive years at best).
    I've heard things like this quite a lot and I don't really understand it? Takeru's goal all along was to return to life and the series ends with him achieving that goal. At no point do they say that him being dead was a requirement for him to transform (and of course Specter uses the same Driver despite being alive the whole time).

    The crossover film with Drive, on the other hand, made no sense. The moral of the film is that you can't cheat death, you just have to accept it, and if that's the case what is even the point of the series this movie's based on?!
    Maybe I've just become too cynical but I'm pretty sure Kamen Rider is "supposed to be about" making big stacks of cash for Toei and Bandai. Anything beyond seems like wishful thinking. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
    I just wanted to pick this out as while I agree I also think that was beyond their control.

    IIRC about six months ago the actress who provided Vernage's voice announced that she was dealing with an illness and on her doctor's recommendation she was completely withdrawing from all work commitments in order to focus on her recovery, which was expected to take several months. She cancelled live appearances, characters she played in anime series were to be recast, everything. So I suspect any plans they had for Vernage had to be dropped too.
     
  14. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    They could have just recast Vernage. It wouldn't be the first time Toei did a fuck you to a show by changing cast members halfway through. At least in this case she was nothing more than a voice. That is the easiest thing to recast. Homer Simpson she ain't.

    As for Agito, I can totally understand if someone doesn't like the show. I loved it, as it has some of the best character growth for any rider ever, and it has a different feel compared to its brethren, but it's also slow moving. If you are looking for an all action ride, Agito is definitely not the place to go.

    Captain, yet again there is NOTHING that makes Nexus a fully plot driven show. Yes, it does have multi-part episodes, but you could cut out most of the entire last arc and nothing will have changed with the show's plot. Nexus is wonderful, however, it is not even remotely close to being full of a plot as you make it out to be. If you get down to it, you could shave off around 20 episodes of its 37 and not feel like you missed a thing. With Build, if you even miss one episode, you will be lost.
     
  15. Black Fang

    Black Fang Member

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    I haven't read much of the manga either, but politics has been in Kamen Rider since the original show. What do you think Shocker, et al are from the Showa era? They're the Cold War era leftist/Tojoist terrorists from the 60s through the 80s in a superhero setting, with ties to secret societies/New World Order types. The Heisei shows that feature formal organizations are a reflection of the modern Bilderbergers, the global tech giants, and "shadow governments", trading in bombs for clean pressed suits and control of the masses through technology and other means. There may not be as much emphasis on these aspects of Heisei shows, or they may not always be written well, but they're there nonetheless.

    I have some more to say about Phase 2 Heisei Rider in general. I've pinpointed the main problems with the past decade:

    - Far too much wacky anime-style hijinks. Sorry, some things just don't translate into a live-action format. Shark brought up tonal whiplash: Phase 2 is chock full of tonal whiplash, going from serious to stupid hijinks to serious again in just one scene at times. Most of the characters who engage in this stuff tend to be the people the heroes hang out with or have tag along with them. Shunpei from Wizard, Drive's SCU, Takeru/Ghost's friends, Poppy and Hiiro's dad from Ex-Aid, all of them are awful and a pain to watch.

    - Not going far enough with the material. All of the Phase 2 shows, even the bad ones, have had some really good and interesting ideas. The problem is that Toei doesn't develop them to their fullest potential, likely out of some desire to keep the show light in tone and play it safe. This ends up hurting the story a lot of the time. In Fourze we see a high school run by an alien-worshiping cult that's looking for new recruits. Some of the students are even willing to go along with it, like Ares, Cancer and even Aquarius. That's creepy. It was a Liveman-style setup. But there's very little emphasis placed on this, for the sake of showing Yuki's latest bout of insanity and "Ucchhuuuuu Kittaaaaaaa!", and the Horoscopes get relegated to MOTW status to rush them through. Ghost had its Buddhist themes, which were done well with Alain and Fumi, and Onari and Javert. But most of the time Onari is a complete idiot who gets into dumb arguments with Akari over SCIENCE! vs PARANORMAL! Drive had all the potential to be Phase 2's Agito. Instead we got the SCU.

    - Poor writing of otherwise interesting characters. Gaim is among the best of Phase 2, but one of its problems was the way Kaito/Baron was written. Here's a guy who is obsessed with having power yet at the same time hates the fact that he thinks he needs it to survive, and so in his youthful naivete wants to recreate the world so that he can achieve utopia. That's a complex hero. But most of the time, Kaito is portrayed like a stereotypical anime rival, the guy who is a loner jerk for no reason and is obsessed with winning at all costs. It's like watching a parody of Seto Kaiba from Yu-Gi-Oh (based on the reviews of Yu-Gi-Oh media I've seen).

    Ex-Aid is even worse. All of its heroes are written like Kaito. They're all anime cliches! It's really irritating to watch, especially with Tojo/Snipe and Hiiro/Brave, because there's more to them than just going "You suck Emu, I don't like you, go away, I'm awesome."

    - Obnoxious merchandising. The talking belts and gears used to be cool in Phase 1 Heisei. Now they never shut the hell up, and don't even say anything useful on top of it. Some of the Riders' gadgets don't even pretend to be anything but toys. It wasn't too bad in W and Fourze, where the only problem was repeating things twice. But OOO and then Wizard onward took it to new levels with a whole song-and-dance number played during henshins and attacks. Then there's all the Legend Rider stuff shoved into the Movie War series or the SHTs, that are out of place, poorly introduced, and unnecessary. If there's one thing Toei could learn from Power Rangers, it's that not all of its merchandise has to appear in the show itself.

    - Focus on guest characters. I don't know if Den-O or anime is the reason for this, but most of the Phase 2 shows have followed this pattern of a random person being targeted by the villains for something and the hero and friends must chase after that random to keep the villains from doing something. With W and Fourze at least, the random people were the villains. But Wizard, Drive, Ghost, and Ex-Aid revolve all around this guest character and devote less time to the main cast. Even hearing the heroes' tag-a-longs explain to civvies that "You are targetted by X and we must keep Y from happening" is tedious and makes them sound like loons.

    W, Gaim and Build aren't perfect. But out of Phase 2, they did the best job with what they had to work with. Even Build's soundtrack has pieces that feel "conspiratorial". These shows really do feel like a real attempt to be as true to Ishinomori's vision (or nightmares) as possible. I don't hate shows like Ex-Aid, Fourze or OOO, but they just didn't go as far as the others.

    EDIT: I don't know if Amazons is included in Phase 2, but I should also mention it as another good show.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2018
  16. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    Yeah, if there is one thing I really hate in Toku shows, it is an incompetent police force, which was quite rampant in the Neo-Heisei stuff.

    I disagree about the OOO belt though. That is hands down the best Kamen Rider belt ever.

    On the other hand, I agree that W is the best show of the Neo-Heisei, followed by Gaim, but I would include OOO before Build. OOO did make a few missteps (like putting Ura on the back burner as the villain for that stupid puppet dummy), but it was still a satisfying show in the end.
     
  17. SamuraiEchidna

    SamuraiEchidna Member

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    Forgive me if I just skim through this topic without reading every last sentence.
    That being said, Captain Shark, I honestly don't know what you're trying to accomplish by making this topic. And I doubt most of the people replying here are going to help. We're all just beating rocks against a brick wall here.

    Captain Shark, you may have some valid points. As much as I loved and will defend Build as one of the better shows of Neo Heisei, I'm not so happy about it that I'd call it perfect. But you've also made points that are based purely on your personal feelings. No one has a right or wrong opinion, regardless of how much your opinion may or may not align with the general consensus. And because of that, I don't think it was necessary to make a topic about this. There's all ready a topic thread for the last episode of Build. And if you're holding firm to what you believe, that Build is shit, then there is no conversation to make here. It's a closed matter, and you're not going to change anyone's minds just by starting a big topic about it.

    To everyone else, unless you agree with what Captain Shark is saying, I don't think there is much point to posting here. If you disagree, fine. Like I said above, I loved Build. It's the last show I'd ever consider to be the worst (personally, Wizard holds that title in my opinion). But opinions aren't always based in facts, they can also be based in feelings. And feelings are harder to change, even if you can educated the viewer. I don't think Captain Shark wants to be swayed or proven wrong here. Captain Shark isn't asking for help or for feedback, the original post pretty much gives of the vibe "This is how things are, and therefore my word is law." No room for conversation.

    But hey, what do I know? I could be wrong. Maybe there is a positive, constructive conversation to be had in all this. Last thing I want to do is censor anybody. I'm just callin' it as I sees it. :cool:
     
  18. Shogun_Master

    Shogun_Master Why is every good TV show Cancelled

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    I think the show never caught on in the U.S. because toku was relatively ignored until Saban made Power Rangers, their adaptation of Kamen Rider Black was horrendous & since then, the show has often been way too violent and dark to be viable as a children's show under U.S. law, but way too silly to be an adult show. I almost wonder, at times, whether or not that's the reason the show had deliberately tried to be more cartoony in the last 10 years. I still think they could easily just dub it or sub it and either release it straight to DVD or put it on Netflix & it'd probably work out. We already know it has a decent sized fan base. If you can release Sentai on DVD & have decent sales, you ought to be able to do the same for Rider, with it having mostly the same audience here, plus the anime crowd would probably eat it up too.

    As to the topic, I have no idea. I haven't even gotten around to Build, yet, but I wanted to see what everyone is talking about. Personally, though, I usually have a somewhat different opinion of Rider than others do. I did just attempt starting Ex-Aid & all I can say is I'm fine with cartoony, as long as the show also takes the drama seriously & the new direction seems to be working fine, so long as they don't get lost somewhere in the middle. Out of all the seasons I've finished-- Kuuga, 555, Kabuto, Kiva, Decade & Gaim-- I'd have to say that Kabuto is, undoubtedly the worst & Gaim was the best, with Kiva taking a hard second. I'm almost done with Ryuki too, so we'll see how that turns out. Kuuga only bothered me because I never figured out what the monsters actually wanted the entire time, other than challenging that Daguva thing, for some unknown reason. 555 was fine, but that cliffhanger is a bit annoying. Kabuto looses track somewhere in the middle and has a horrible finale. Decade was alright for what it was, but didn't get serious until the final episode & if I hadn't looked up some other stuff beforehand, I wouldn't have been able to make heads or tails of it, either.
     
  19. Black Fang

    Black Fang Member

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    ^ I'm three quarters done with Ex-Aid now. The show improves dramatically in the second half once Kamen Rider Chronicle begins to be played en masse by the public. However it's still hampered by stupid hijinks and anime cliche writing for the heroes. However I will grant that Hiiro does mellow out a bit from the first half and becomes more like how he should've been from the beginning, an older, more grounded mentor-type figure for Emu.

    Nope. Not only does is the singing annoying, why on Earth would a belt made in medieval Europe be speaking Japanese in the first place? In fact, why involve Europe at all? The first OOO and the medals could've been created by Japanese alchemists/sorcerers/whatever. Then the shogun from the movie could've had some actual relation to OOO's past instead of just another excuse for Toei to use its feudal Edo set.

    I also don't care for the transparency of the medals. Solid metal would've looked nicer.

    Wrong again. OOO is better than Den-O, but not Ryuki or Amazons (I'll compare all of Kobayashi's Riders here.) It may not have dropped the ball as much as Wizard or Ghost, but OOO is still lackluster compared to Build or Gaim or W, or any 1st half Phase 1, from that bad ska punk soundtrack to the Greeds being watered down Grongi to making Kougami a raving loon rather than a competent mastermind. Even the OOO suit is a waste: a chimeric Rider ought to look a lot more bestial, like Gills or the wild Amazons. The SIC versions are how they ought to have looked in the show, not that overly clean suit with all the color on front and nothing in the back.

    W, Gaim and Build I rank together. I think even Gaim and Build didn't have as much dumb antics as W did. The stuff they did have felt like they were just there to fill the minimum quota.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2018
  20. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    Actually, it's not as easy as you would think because Toei wants the same price for the Kamen Rider license that they do for One Piece and Dragonball. That's just too much for smaller companies to spend on such a huge risk.

    Why do I care about Europe? I'm talking about the belt gimmick itself with the coins. It's by far my favorite system. I don't give a damn who made it in universe. That has nothing to do with the story of the show.

    In fact, if I recall, Foundation X made the coins.

    Den-O and Ryuki are not Neo-Heisei. I don't even know what you're talking about now. Are you comparing all the Heisei series or just the Neo-Heisei ones? I was solely talking about the Neo-Heisei shows. If I'm talking about the Heisei ones, then duh OOO is not better than Blade, Ryuki, and Agito. Kuuga and Kiva are debatable, but 555, Kabuto, Decade, Hibiki, and Den-O are a given. Though, if Hibiki had not fumbled during its second half, it may have been a top 10 show.
     

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