Has Zi-O Redeemed Kamen Rider?

Discussion in 'Henshin Justice Unlimited' started by Captain Shark, Jul 31, 2019.

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  1. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    Build still remains the worst tokusatsu ever made, but it wasn't the sole reason the franchise has crashed since Ex-Aid was our early warning sign something was off. For two years in a row we have been wrongfully subjugated to this portal of hell called a mouth that talked with endless dialogue in a sad attempt to break rules, not realizing why those rules were there to begin with. 2018 felt like it is still going on despite us almost being in August in 2019. Now we have Zi-O, which is meant to be the celebration of the last 19 years (although it advertises 20) not unlike Decade (which was better than all the post-J rider series that came before it). Toei put out the stops for this, giving it the Timeranger treatment and motif, but does it work?

    Sort of.

    It starts off successfully ending Build's sad joke of a reign by tearing out its unique continuity by forcing it into the mold as if to fix it and the first two episodes easily brought that entire dark history of tokusatsu to its knees. Brilliant. Like when Google slaps a gag on right wing propaganda on YouTube and Ted Cruz throws his beloved hissy fit (Bet really needed to beat him). The next two episodes immediately found the detractor called Ex-Aid and made a better version of it by not having endless soap opera drivel. Ever episode did what it needed to: Focus on the effects and action. Every two episodes (much like past entries had so many) featured minor tributing with every monster of the week being the riders reimagined, almost as a meta commentary as Toei recycles powers onto successors. Every rider was getting their representation and Decade comes back as an anti-hero.

    And then came Kamen Rider Woz. Now we have two parters dedicated to three riders that don't exist. That would be six episodes of nonsense. This would be fine except it detracts from the tributes entirely and now the few that didn't get their fair share have to be shoved into the epilogue movie. And then there are these Rider Time specials, one for a non-existent rider and another for Ryuki of all things aka the first entry not to use the bug motif, shoe horn in slice of life trash, and failing to deliver things in series requiring supplementary material to show off everything promised (in Ryuki's case 13 riders). To make it worse there has slowly, almost out of the shadows, pointless talking has been seeping back in for no reason.

    Is Toei sabotaging itself on purpose? It had a golden opportunity to redeem this 48 year old franchise, but it distracts itself. This is like when Google wrongfully unbanned Black Pigeon Speaks or Pelosi failing to grow a spine and impeach Trump, there is no sense to it and doing so only worsens like a rot in the flesh by the bite of a brown recluse spider.

    Zi-O had an important job of bringing redemption, but that redemption has not arrived.
  2. Black Fang

    Black Fang Member

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    Your post is invalid right from the start with your first sentence.

    But Toei does has a problem. American superheroes have a problem. It's the same problem with different variations. Too much stupidity, too much merchandise peddling, and too many fans who swallow it up hook, line and sinker.
    Japaneseseriesfan likes this.
  3. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    I was in denial that Build could be that awful at first too, but you'll come around.
  4. Japaneseseriesfan

    Japaneseseriesfan A simple passerby...

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    Even at it's lowest, Build was much more enjoyable than Zi-O ever was. Build at least had a strong start, a good mystery to build of, but failed on it's last arc when it could have really turned the tide and do something else instead of the Saint Seiya formula i.e. the characters needing to constantly fight against an enemy that's been defeated over and over again, running up the stairs to a palace, sacrificing each other. Zi-O doesn't even have the decency to make anything tie together, except for convenient plot contrivances.

    I'm also starting to think you're just an SJW, speaking in an echochamer whenever you use words like "we", "our", and "us". Clearly, you've been told multiple times that not everyone agrees with you, or your statements, and to not speak for other people or frame it like that. That, and the unnecessary comparison to Trump and the references to bashing of right-wing media. It's Tokusatsu, no one really cares about the amount of American politics comparison drivels you can make to it.

    "Every Rider was getting their representation". Oh jeez, another buzzword. Seriously, they should have just left some series alone if they can't properly tie it in. The peak of it ever getting anything right was probably Agito's episodes, and that had to reuse Another Agito's suits for it's Another Rider concept. Clearly, something went sour so fast the moment they realized even the name "Another Agito" had already been used.

    The three "non-existent" Riders provided a lot more entertainment value than some of the tribute episodes this series ever did, especially with Quiz.

    And no, I don't think Black Fang will ever agree with you on Build. He's not in denial, that man has a good head on his shoulders.
    Black Fang likes this.
  5. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    Not even sure why I'm posting since I know exactly where this topic is going to lead, but no, Zi-O is utter shit. It makes Ghost look like the messiah.
  6. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    While I'm only 26 episodes into Zi-O, all of them were far better and more entertaining than Build ever was.
    That is a lie.
    Yes it does: Get all the powers of previous riders since they're all in the same continuity. Wow that statement was easy to debunk.
    Unironically using trope logic is a poor debate maneuver.
    SJWs don't call out Kamala Harris for being a crooked prosecutor, I have. Checkmate.
    I'm aware, I just don't care, I'm going to state the facts regardless of what Tim Pool level misdirections will be fired at me. Show me a worse tokusatsu than Build, pro tip: You can't, because it does not exist, I have looked.
    Because not calling out obvious lies will make it more likely for people to claim they are somehow true so they must be caught out at every turn.
    Zi-O set out to represent all previous heisei riders, that was the main goal, and when it fails it must be pointed out.
    Turn A tried that with Gundam and it ended up nearly killing the franchise while Seed and Destiny actually bothered doing it and they became the highest selling entries in the franchise only after the first series and Zeta. It's almost as if putting in everyone shows effort and care, hmmmmm.
    Haven't gotten that far, but complaining just about name recycling is a bit much.
    You spelled the word "boring" incorrectly.
    His loss.
    By not acknowledging cancer as cancer? Define "good" if you will.
    You think every tokusatsu after Gekiranger is the bad-ness ness ness (hey look, a Sheep in The Big City reference!).
  7. Kamen Rider IXA

    Kamen Rider IXA Lurker

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    You know, I won't go into your other points for now, but this one really gives fuel to "you're just a troll" arguments.
    If Zi-O doesn't capture essense of the series, what's the point of bringing it back at all?
    You may replace Ex-Aid with another "made up Rider" and not only "tribute" won't get worse, it actually will improve drastically, since it won't have series' buggage like lore and characters and you may treat it as its own thing. If Zi-O is a celebration that doesn't actually CELEBRATE, what's the point of doing it? It may as well be just all future Riders and people would just complain about it less.
    If I want to do a proper 555 tribute, I'd have to deal with characters, storylines and yes, melodrama of the series, regardless of how I personally feel about it. Because 555 is the series heavily rooted in relationships. Even Kamen Rider 4 sort of understood that, despite feeling pretty different from 555. You can do a tribute without taking all this into account, but it likely won't be a proper 555 tribute and I'd get raised eyebrows from 555 fans. At very least.
    And why do you care about whether Rider is real or not? You dislike most of Heisei series anyway. From what I hear, future Riders don't have a lot of "talking bits", so they seems right up your "action and effects" alley.
  8. Japaneseseriesfan

    Japaneseseriesfan A simple passerby...

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    Forgive me, I just realized. He's not a troll, not an SJW, just a some guy with a total lack of self-awareness of people around him, to the point that he doesn't even realize all of his talking points align him with SJW-tendencies.

    I don't care if you don't care. You're still not allowed to speak for others and act as if your opinions and subjective statements are facts and objective statements. Your comparison to Tim Pool is a poor deflection, but it seems that's all you can handle; make comparisons to either YouTubers and their political nature, or Politics in general. You don't get to speak on behalf of people, which is exactly what SJWs do.

    Turn A Gundam's primary downfall was in it's design and how unlike a Gundam it was, and it's actually quite a decent idea. Again, you only think shallow. Seed and Seed Destiny are a shit show.

    Stop putting words in other people's mouths that they didn't speak. I didn't "spell "boring" incorrectly", that's your damn opinion.

    I don't need to define "good" for you. You either know it, or you don't. It's that simple.
  9. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    It's an anniversary series, representation is required when that is what you set out to do. Decade did similar and it was better than the stuff it was celebrating because it got rid of all the baggage.
    If by improve you mean devalue because made up riders don't belong here. Next.
    Define "proper".
    All you need is a school setting and some orphnocs with a ref here and there. And hey, Fourze had a school setting so it was a good opportunity to mix 'em.
    Not really.
    Anniversary series.
    Most are mediocre or good, congratulations for thinking you can speak for me and fail.
    Except they have more talking bits than the tribute episodes, don't throw in dishonesty.
    More like I could not care less.
    More like I am aware but don't care. I'm not a troll, I'm a zealot, I'd rather you not respond to me.
    Wow you just contradicted yourself.
    It was so decent that it almost killed the franchise.
    Strange way of spelling "well made", but hey, kids these days.
    Try practicing what you preach.
    Because your intellectual dark web masters have done it for you, funded by Vilks brothers money.
  10. Shogun_Master

    Shogun_Master Why is every good TV show Cancelled

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    I dunno. I guess the dude really likes the Den-O - Wizard seasons. To each their own.

    lmao, at least he admits it. I really have no clue what he's a zealot towards, but whatever. At least he seems to know what he's doing with himself.

    By the way, though, Zi-O does get worse. You're almost at the point where the show just completely loses track of what it's actually trying to do or the story it's trying to tell altogether & just starts being random.
  11. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    Except Turn A is one of the best Gundam series ever.

    SEED is only good if you are new to the franchise while Destiny is the second worst Gundam series.

    Also, they are not well made because they relied way too heavily on stock footage, flashback scenes, and each series has several clip shows.
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  12. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    No, Decade did it better because Zi-O brought back the actual original actors to many of the series but ignored how each of those series played out and actually ended. Decade not only recast the actors, but also created new histories for those worlds because they had new actors.
  13. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    You spelled "worst" wrong, it had very little going for it.
    Exept that is wrong, Seed is UC done correctly while Destiny is the best of Gundam.
    Stock footage is good.
    And those are not bad, what's your point?
    Which is why Decade is so much better than its predecessors and they don't waste 40 episodes of whatever, only 2!
    More like it was an improvement over the last five seasons. On top of that W was easily a black mark on that era and Den-O dropped it in the last nine eps.
  14. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Member

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    You spelled "originality" wrong.

    All right, you're either retarded or just a complete and utter troll.
  15. Japaneseseriesfan

    Japaneseseriesfan A simple passerby...

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    I’m convinced he’s got some kind of mental handicap, probably Asperger’s. The guy can only project things onto others, he can’t take anyone’s opinion unless it benefits him somehow.

    Also, proclaiming yourself as a zealot is a bad move. That’s the definition of retardation and cancer in any fandom. Ironic, considering he thinks of himself as some type of cancer-callout guy.

    This is a forum, I am free to post where I want and when I want, if I want to. Just like how you don’t care about what others have to say, I don’t care what you have to ask of me. You have no right to limit my free speech in any way shape or form (ironic, considering you’re from a a country that was founded on those principles and I’m from a country that restricts certain types of speeches as it’s laws), I am free to speak to whomever I choose to. I’m also pretty sure plenty of people wished you never got involved in any of the threads and discussions they created because you turn the entire conversation into a shitstorm and derail all healthy discussions, yet none of them has ever asked you (not as far as I’ve seen anyways) to stay out of their threads or not talk to them.

    Not caring what others think is a sign of an emotionally stunted person. You gave me a good laugh when you say “kids these days”, clearly, you’re the child, because I highly doubt you’re even out of school/college. As far as I can tell, if you were any older, you’d have grown up getting the living shit kicked out of you for trying to sound like a smartass all the time and would have known better. Go outside and get some real friends. If you can’t, go buy or adopt a pet or something. From the looks of it, you’re highly obsessed with thinking that your way of thought is the only “right” and “true” way of thinking, which is clearly false. It’s not unreasonable to assume you don’t have a healthy social life at all.
  16. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    I am neither.
    That's a big bucket of wrong you got there because I have no mental handicap.
    The only people that call zealots cancer are those that cannot stand change, for a guy that complains about stagnation all the time you sure are going against your own statements.
    More like I used to care, got attacked constantly, stopped caring for a bit, realized there is no difference, and took the path of least resistance.
    Good thing you didn't bet money on it because I have graduated college, checkmate.
    I've never been in a fight, you sure do live wild ass assumptions, don't you?
    In the real world that gets you shot in this country.
    Why would I want to be shackled to another organism that can't take care of itself?
    I base information on facts, not feelings which I wish I could stop having.
    I have a job to mouth jibber with other members of my species, it's like you can't stop being wrong.
  17. Japaneseseriesfan

    Japaneseseriesfan A simple passerby...

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    Clearly, that college education was a waste then (another point towards the American education system being a massive failure). Because I didn't say I thought you lived a life getting the living shit kicked out of you. I said IF you were any older than what I thought you were. Clearly, you were just a little bit older than what I assumed, so no, it was a "wild assumption". So I was right. You've never had your own ass handed to you. See, this is why, as much as I hated bullies all throughout school, I recognize they were a necessary force to help shape someone who can tell right from wrong because they experienced injustice first hand and trained themselves to be able to fight the bullies back.

    No, clearly getting friends doesn't "get you shot" I lived in the US for a couple of years, had no trouble making friends and had no indication of getting shot except for a few smart mouthed gun owners.

    Also, I never said anything about shackling the pet or you. I don't put collars on mine, because I train them well enough. They're free to roam wherever they want, and they know what to do if they want to go home. Plus, I never have to worry about anything besides opening a can of food for them, they're all potty trained. They offer great company.

    It's quite evident you're determined to be some kind of robot, thinking that emotional responses are "useless". There's a thin line between logic and emotion, as well as objective and subjective experiences, to the point that they're very blurred at times. To live "thinking" that you only base your information on "facts" is a complete lie, because you're engaging in faux stoicism. The only reason people of the past were able to come to logical conclusions on what is "objectively bad and good" is because they weighed the emotional effects those experiences had. You'd learn this is if you took a philosophy class with a competent teacher, or you'd find this out on your own by engaging in the study of it yourself and having talks about it with some real friends once in a while.

    And no, I'm not even wrong. I don't consider talking with other people with an open heart and open mind "mouth jibber". And no, it's not a "job", you can simply refuse to respond. Clearly, you didn't take the path of least resistance when it came to this exact response, which would be not to reply.

    Lastly, being a zealot is not some "absolute way" of making change. You see, the reason why you're at odds with people in this community is because we all love conversations characters have and their ideals, because it gives them personality and make them human. Because they teach us about what it means to be a hero, and I'm willing to bet my left and right balls that more than half the people on this community looked up to them as examples of what heroes should be like. That's why we love them. You on the other hand, praise shows that are just lacking heroics or flawed, incomplete or poorly written and, often times in reality, unrealistic versions of them.

    You do have a handicap. It's called 21st-century-first-world-lack-of-emotional-growth-issues.

    And no, I have never gone against my own statements. I've pushed for change behind the scenes when I went to work in Japan in animation and live action productions. I just happened to be outnumbered by a bunch of people who wanted to be as "diplomatic" (tiptoeing and playing politics) as possible, so no, being a zealot doesn't get you anywhere. You HAVE to play the game, or you'll be fired long before you realize it for losing your temper and yelling at another employee about how much of a non-talent hack they are (that's speaking from experience). At the end of the day, what are you gonna do about it? One person can't achieve anything, you NEED others to cooperate with you, and the only way you can do that is to first agree on a shared reality. You can't even do that with anyone in this thread, what makes you think you can change anything by being an internet warrior?
  18. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    Automatically you have disqualified yourself from any level of moral high ground for saying bullying is in any way necessary.
    It was in no way wasted.
    It depends on what area you live in, you chose a lucky spot.
    >not putting your dog on a leash when taking them outside so they can run off and jump on people

    I have met way too many people like that in real life, what I wouldn't give to live in a place devoid of pet owners.
    Unless you have a functioning set of eyes and standards, then it's as clear as day.
    Outside of hobby reasons I see no practical reason of ever taking such course unless it was mandatory, the only type of class more useless are literature ones.
    I have friends, try using the internet once in a while for reasons other than complaining about people who disagree with you.
    Your pants are on fire so hot Shinji Aoba would tell you to get a fire extinguisher.
    You haven't engaged in American politics, I can tell. If you are not a hardline zealot you don't get votes and are seen as clay when iron is what is needed to bust bones.
    Nice lies, but I do no such thing.
    Ah, so you watch Computing Forever unironically, you could have saved me time by saying that from the get go.
    Yes you have and frequently.
    That works in sane countries, not in America.
    Do what I do and never stop.
    Moscow Mitch single handedly manages to uproot and destroy the federal judicial system, the constitution, and our elections, plus there are many examples in this country of rogue gunmen destroying many innocent lives and sending people into a constant state of misery. They are very horrendous accomplishments that deserve to be condemned, but they are accomplished actions by individuals nontheless.
    Until automation FINALLY puts us all out of the job and we just rely on AI to do everything for us.
    YOU went after ME first. YOU don't want to cooperate. I'd rather do things myself than be assisted by someone who is clearly going to stray away sooner or later. I play long game.
  19. Japaneseseriesfan

    Japaneseseriesfan A simple passerby...

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    See, all of this is just projections. I doubt you've lived in anywhere but America, but the phrase "the grass is greener on the other side" is very true. You're acting like one of those people who went crazy after Trump became president. Newsflash: Everywhere else in the world has similar issues. The way the people of each country deal with it is simply different.

    When I said one person can't do anything, it was a given I was talking about accomplishing good. Clearly, now you're just trying to be a contrarian and nitpick words. The word "accomplished" is a word that has good connotations to it. You don't play semantics and try to start a debate everywhere possible just because it's convenient for you to paint yourself as somehow being "wronged". Like, seriously, you have a severe victim mentality, acting as if everything is out to get you or something.

    And no, I certainly didn't pick a "lucky spot" to live. Some punk broke into my apartment and stole my laptop, taking any evidence I would have had to sue even Netflix that they ripped me off and refused to pay with them.

    Clearly, I attempted to cooperate, but all you do is this bullshit of "you spelled this wrong" when clearly, they intended the opposite. You're the one who refused to cooperate with even agreeing to a shared reality and definitions, instead projecting your own twisted ones onto them.

    And I have no idea who the fuck Computing Forever even is, so there you go, your assumptions about things and people who talk to you are just that, assumptions.

    I have engaged in talks about American politics, and I was pretty clear whenever I talked to anyone about it. People call Thailand the sick man of Asia because we have a third world economy but the people in our country are trying to live first world lifestyles, which in turn causes all the problems we have today. America's the opposite. You have a first world economy, but the majority of your people have third world-like mentalities and tactics when it comes to politics, and that's clearly your education system's fault (I went to an American school here, I know exactly what kind of bullshit they try to teach and pass). Our leaders are much worse than yours, and they're much more sophisticated when it comes to how they fuck over the citizens. The only difference is the currency value that America holds that ever gave it any power over countries like mine. So no, I can make easy comparisons and see exactly how all of this is going to play out by just reverse-engineering the roles and just simply looking at history. Our Democrats would be Republicans in America, and our Republicans would be your Democrats. It's not rocket science. Your Republicans talk about making America great, our Republicans fuck our country to shit hole by allowing Democrats like Obama to interfere with our political issues and virtue signal to us when we were trying to stage a coup d'état to overthrow a prime minister who was a puppet of the previous one we exiled from our country to begin with.

    And I have plenty of friends, and I don't use the internet to just argue with people. I use it to find information and connect with people and use it for work. Once in a while, someone like you who thinks they must be an absolutist comes along and tries to put words in my mouth, and I get annoyed. That's simply it.
  20. Captain Shark

    Captain Shark Member

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    And I doubt you've ever been here based on that response.
    So you're okay with a republic becoming an autocracy and giving no regulation to corporations and green hosue emissions, gottcha.
    More like I debunked your false claim and you are failing to come up with a decent response so you just hurl insults.
    I don't think you know how victim complexes work if that is what you are thinking.
    Because that is the correct mentality.
    You act like ours haven't done that and aren't trying to do worse.
    And Putin is interfering with our elections and republicans over here are letting it happen.
    Could have fooled me.
    You do the exact same to me, nice projection you got there.
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